Forest Gate pub guide: 2014

A year ago we published one of our most read, and certainly commented upon, blogs, on Forest Gate pubs - past and present (see here). Well, a year is a long time in supping, and much beer has flown  since then, so it's time for an update on where things stand. And the news isn't, overwhelmingly great.

Below: we record a  success,  welcome an addition, rectify an omission, regret some closures, update some wobblers, report some progress and dig up some history.

The success

The undoubted pub success of the last year has been the opening of the Forest Tavern, on the site of the old down-at-heel Railway Tavern.  Bought by the London chain of gastro-pub, shabby chic specialists, Antic, eighteen months ago, the pub opened last September, to much local acclaim, and affirmations that gentrification was finally arriving in Forest Gate.

It's a pub and chain that listens to its customers. So, bit by bit has added a restaurant, an interesting range of bar snacks, entertainment nights (Forest Gap, comedy and quiz nights), a monthly record fair, a good, tasty range of real ales, ciders etc. and most recently a (rather uninspiring) back garden. There's no piped music or intrusive TV, so lots of animated chat and conviviality, from an overwhelmingly white, middle class clientele.



Great success: Forest Tavern

The food menu hasn't perhaps lived up to its early promise, and those concerned with the pub's management (and profit and loss accounts) must be a little disappointed at the apparent lack of take-off of the restaurant.

But, the venue has certainly become a favoured meeting place, and big hit with so many who have been frustrated at Forest Gate's lack of a decent pub, over the years.

The addition

The bravest initiative over the last year, however, has undoubtedly been the roar-away success of the Wanstead Tap. Stuck out of the way (352 Winchelsea Road - round the corner from the Holly Tree - see below), in a railway arch (surrounded by car repairers), with trains rumbling overhead, and no beer on tap. Madness; a guaranteed failure by someone who didn't have a clue; a certain money loser, failure, bankruptcy inducer and early closure.

How wrong! A real welcome awaits from a delightful mine host and friends and relatives; coffee shop and toy and game-packed environment for those with toddler care in afternoons and a huge and absolutely delightful range of bottled beers and ciders in the evenings for drinkers.  Here's a beer seller, who loves his job and is ever on the look-out for new stock to add to his already very impressive range.


Unlikely success: Wanstead tap

And at night, a fascinating range of wide-ranging activities to entertain the patrons.  Great supper nights, once a fortnight, with food supplied by Forest Gate's gourmet chef, Michael Sanders, timely film showings (Mrs Doubtfire the night after Robin Williams' death), fascinating talks by authors and music makers with local connections, or stories to relay.

If you haven't been - don't delay. But not because the much predicted closure beckons!

The omission

Lots of flack for a key omission from last year's listing - the Holly Tree on Dames Road. Although (like the Wanstead Tap, above) not in Newham, it is in Forest Gate, and there has been a pub on the site since at least 1870 - so mea culpa.  Here's a quick addition to last year's listings.



Last year's omission: The Holly Tree, Dames Road

It's a popular pub, offering simple hot food (with a 4 star food safety certificate)and a range of entertainments, including sports on TV, Karaoke on Fridays (from a small raised stage area), a pool table and some gaming machines.

There's an outside garden, which overlooks Wanstead Flats and hosts popular barbeques in the summer. It even has some simple children's play equipment.  One of the best features of the pub is the large conservatory extension, offering pleasant, airy views of the Flats.

The closures

It was almost inevitable that there would be losers and closures over the year, following the national trend. And so it has been. Within four months of last year's article, the Live and Let Live (or "The Live", as it was generally known) died and is currently boarded up (see photo), with no sign of a new licensee, or even new use, in sight. A real shame, not only to see a pub with history go, but one in what is rapidly becoming the scruffiest, most unwelcoming parts of Forest Gate.


Dying on its feet: The Live and Let Live

Last year, we reported on the (then) recent closure of Temptations, which had operated as a nightclub on the site of the old Wagon and Horses on Romford Road.  It was closed, following complaints of rowdiness from neighbours.  There was always a possibility that it could have re-opened as a pub.

But no - it has followed the trend running in former pubs such as the Princess Alice - a little further down the road - and become and Asian restaurant.  It looks smart (as the photo shows) and has only recently opened, so it's very much, watch this space to see how it prospers.  But, one more local pub closure confirmed.

From Wagon and Horses to Temptaions,
now just the Family Grill, Romford Road

The wobblers

As predicted last year, the most likely victim of the Forest Tavern's success was the Fox and Hounds, almost next door, on Forest Lane. And so it has proved to be. Enterprise (a company that leases pubs to landlords/tenants) has recently posted details on its website of the availability of the pub, as a new business challenge for somebody.

Their website puts its best spin on what's on offer "This is a real 'heart of the community' traditional 1930's public house, with an original U-shape central bar, tons of original features, fireplaces, warmth and charm. It also benefits from a rear paved ('secret') garden, and well maintained three bed private accommodation."

Up for grabs, with £1,000 a week running costs

The annual rent is £35k, with additional estimated costs of £16k p.a. It must be a big ask to clear £1,000 per week "profit" from the pub, before making a wage!

Watch this space, for a forthcoming closure or very serious competition for the Forest Tavern.

The old Freemason's Arms (called Simpsons from the 1980's until around 2000), 324 Romford Road was boarded up at the time of last year's pub round up.  It still is, albeit with a scaffold-supported roof cover now.  It is not clear what will happen to this building, but a re-emergence as a pub seems highly unlikely.


Simpsons, further down the road of dereliction

The standing and operating

In summary then, Forest Gate now supports only 6 pubs:  Forest Gate Hotel (Sebert Road) , Forest Tavern (Forest Lane), Fox and Hounds (Forest Lane), Golden Fleece (Capel Road),  Holly Tree (Dames Road) and Hudson Bay (Upton Lane) , and one pub-like establishment (Wanstead Tap, Winchelsea Road).

Progress report: Old Spotted Dog, Upton Lane

The Grade 11 listed former pub continues to be boarded up, and remains in the hands of a liquidator, who having held it for about seven years, is trying to dispose of the site. There have been some pre-planning application enquiries about using the car park area for residential accommodation, but these have not progressed. The liquidators have been helpful to the local campaign to save/reopen the pub, who report that, despite its outward appearance, it seems fairly watertight inside and not too structurally damaged.
 

Fighting for survival and refurbing: The Old Spotted Dog

Previous squatters have been evicted and the site is reasonably well secured and patrolled. The Campaign held a well attended and successful public meeting in April this year and have been able to report interest from the Prince's Regeneration Trust, in helping them secure a community future for the pub. Realistically, it is going to take at least £2m to acquire and refurb the location, so the campaign group has set up a trust with a view to raising the money and seeking to get some building plans drawn up. Contact them for further details, and how to help and get involved.

Updated history

Meanwhile, this website provides details of additional, Forest Gate pubs, that have been closed over the last century, that did not feature in last year's listing, and provides further details and photographs of some of those already covered. Huge thanks to them for their painstaking work.

The Builders' Arms, 47 Station Road, Forest Gate. There was a pub here, from at least 1874 until 1934.  Its last recorded publican was Herbert Henry Webb. There are now garages, attached to flats built on the former pub site.

Camden Arms, 70 Field Road. Although we recorded this pub, which closed in 2008, we didn't have photo of it.  Below is one (thanks to Stephen Harris). There was a pub on this site, although clearly at least one pre-dating the one in the photo, from at least 1870. There are now flats built on the site of the old pub 

Camden Arms, after closure

Earl of Derby, Station Road, Forest Gate. The fate of this pub caused a little controversy following last year's posting, when we described it as having been subsequently tuned into a nursery.  The photo below (thanks to Stephen Harris) confirms this fact. The pub was managed in the 1930's by former World Bantamweight Boxing champion, Teddy Baldock, who had to hand it back to the brewery during World War 11, when custom dried up.


Let there be no doubt, what was
the Earl of Derby is now a nursery!

Forest Glen, Dames Road.  There has been little change from last year, as the pub still appears to be awaiting refurbishment into residential accommodation, and possibly a restaurant.

The Globe, 40 Chestnut Avenue.  There was, what must have been a small,  pub on this site, according to trade directories from 1871 - 1886. The building remains, as a house.

It's a small world: site
of The Globe, Chestnut Road

Golden Horse, 111 Forest Lane.  A pub of that name was listed at this location in trade directories from 1861 - 1934, and continued until the 1950s. The pub and a large area of Odessa and Wellington Roads were bombed in the second World War, and prefabs and a prefabricated Golden Horse were ereceted on the site. They have subsequently been demolished ard the area is now occupied by  St James' school playground.

Jolly Smiths - Field Road. This pub existed between 1871 and 1885, until its publican, Edward Prince surrendered his licence to local magistrates. We don't have its exact location, unfortunately.

Parliament House, 1 Parliament Place, which subsequently became 63 Forest Street, by the 1911 census. A pub of this name was located there from 1871 - 1944. For a lengthy time at the end of the nineteenth century it was in the hands of the Burren family, who were landlords of a number of pubs in Kent and elsewhere in East London. The site of this former pub is now occupied by part of Forest Gate Community School.

The Plough, 55 Field Road. There was a pub here from 1871 - 1887. It is now the Al Dubbagh Indian restaurant and take-away.


Once The Plough, now and Indian take-away

Prince of Wales, 58 Forest Street. A pub of this name was located here 1872 - 1886. The building has long gone and the site is now occupied by flats, behind Forest Gate Community school.

Railway Bell, 129 Forest Lane, 1877 - 1886. This site is now residential accommodation.

The former Railway Bell, Forest Lane

Travellers' Rest, 12 Cemetery Road. Thanks to Brian Berry for use of a photo of the most recent manifestation of a pub that had been on the site from 1871, until its recent transformation into flats.


Site of Travellers' Rest, Cemetery Road

Well, that's this year's round-up.  At the current space of developments, it is likely to need an update - and we hope a better news on -a year hence.

The 24 hour Forest Gate gourmet trail

 Stuck for an idea for a  celebration? Don't want to travel too far? Fed up with fancy West End prices? Had enough of rip off late night taxi fares?

Stay local, play at home and join the 24 hour Forest Gate gourmet trail!

We tried it last weekend, and it was great! It was a celebration with a difference, but with a distinct E7 flavour - in more ways than one!
We started last Friday evening at about 7pm and popped into the Forest Tavern for an aperitif - and, inevitably, meet a friendly face or two for a natter, over a very pleasant, well presented and interesting beverage (a fine range of craft beers and ciders and some pretty decent wines on sale at non-exorbitant prices).
  

Aromas - fall into it from the Forest
Gate Tavern, and enjoy the meal!

Then, next door for a meal at the recently opened Aroma's Indian restaurant. "Unpretentious", the foodies would call it, and pretty basic in terms of comfort, with a fairly simple and very veggie-friendly menu.  But the food is GOOD: freshly cooked, flavoursome and served with a smile. It's a bring your own alcohol place, so a fortune can be saved there, for the drinkers.
 
Since the demise of the Empress on Romford Road and Sagor's at the top of High Street North, we've been a bit short of decent Indian's, locally - outside Green St, of course. And Aroma's plugs the gap. Cheap, cheerful - and delicious!

For these reasons, alone, it deserves to survive.  Not sure how it's faring businesswise - there weren't too many diners there at what is normally a peak time for restaurants - but it comes highly recommended from here.  Use it, before we lose it!

End of day one - pretty good. Then back for bed.

Day 2 - Saturday - started off with a stroll along to CoffeE7 for a great little breakfast.  A small, but very pleasing, veggie, menu, with a decent selection of drinks (the hot ones all excellently brewed). The place is busy, shabby, chic and a huge asset to the local community - particularly now it is running book nights, music sessions and hosts local artists.


CoffeE7 - epitome of Community Caff

Want a "community caff?" - they set the standard.

Then we tipped outside to the market and stocked up on organic eggs and vegetables (plenty of very good breads on sale too, if you want). We were too full to indulge in some of the hot food on sale - but previous tastings tell us that we could loosened our belts with a fill up of tasty fare, with no problem.  But, we couldn't resists a take away cake or three from the jolly WI stall - for later.  So, a bag of morning-baked goodies for us it was, then.



No stereotypes here - WI cake stall.
Fresh and delicious!

A stroll was now in order, to walk off some of the calories - so it was up Dames Road, to Winchelsea Road, and the railway arches.

Arch 352 is a must! Slightly off the beaten track (off Pevensey Road, behind the Holly Tree as the promo literature says).  But get along! It's the new HQ for The Wanstead Tap and Cafe. It's only been up and running for a couple of weeks - and is a delight, that will take off. It boasts the usual wide range of, we are told, interesting, locally brewed beers (you know, the ones with the daft and pretentious names) and ciders.
 
These will become much more freely available once they've ironed out a few problems in the locality (probably after the up-coming local elections when aspiring politicians aren't groping around for bandwagons to jump on).



Wanstead Tap - interesting alcohol, tasty
nibbles, good company - and very child friendly.
That's a big niche sorted!

In addition to the booze, they offer what they modestly (but accurately) describe as "great coffee, great cakes and loads of space for kids".  Yup, a really child friendly meet up point ("probably the biggest buggy space in Forest Gate"), with booze to ease the pain!

For the future, we are teased with offers of films and events, maybe a bit of posh dining in store - so watch this - and many - other spaces, for details.

Cake and coffee for us here (a kind of late elevenses in our day of nosh). Then back to the hub of E7, and a wander in to the Forest Tavern, to stick our head round the record fair (first Saturday in each month). Not much took our fancy, to be frank - but I guess we aren't their target demographic (as the marketeers would have it). But so much better to have, than not have. Keep spinning!

We resisted the temptation for a guzzle in the bar, so stumbled over Forest Lane to the small rotunda outside the railway station, that used to be a flower stall.

It has recently become - you may have noticed - Forest Gate's very own creperie. We couldn't resist. They were pretty decent and more than reasonably priced - particularly when taken in conjunction with a cup of freshly brewed coffee. Armetis is the name. Give it a go! The guy who runs it is charming.

A creperie in Forest Gate? Surely not?
Yup, in the rotunda outside the railway station.
Give it a go - they are better than
pancakes, you know!

It is, however, very small - only room for one worker and with a trade selling freshly produced goodies (the crepes and the coffees),  service may not be of the quickest, and so the place avoided by the busy commuters who, I guess it hopes to serve. It would be a real shame if it went under - so, be like me - and become very patronising!

Suitably stuffed, it was a wander home for an afternoon's domestic activities (not forgetting a nibble of some of the WI's finest!), before setting out for dinner, to end the 24hr FG FoodFest, at the Forest Gate Tavern restaurant.



Forest Gate Tavern opened six months
and revolutionised local drinking and eating

Yet another local treat. A smallish, but delightful, menu in what pubs in this chain hate to be called a gastro pub. Very veggie friendly, very fresh food, imaginatively cooked and served by delightful staff. Excellent value and a must return venue, for us.

Thus bringing to an end, a good 24-hour local tour, nosh, nibble, and guzzle for two, all for about £100. Bargain!

A couple of things to ponder: firstly an apology. Stomach capacity prevented a visit to the Siam cafe, which a couple of years ago was about the only place worth eating at in the area, nor to the excellent Kaffine coffee shop - opposite the station.  Both are smashing little eateries in their own way, and would have been included if time, wallet and space for food permitted.

And secondly - as the previous paragraph suggests - all of the places on our trip have opened within the last eighteen months. Quite remarkable - from food desert to delight in less than two years.  How this place is changing!

Next week; altogether much more serious stuff. A fascinating insight into Fascists in Forest Gate in the 1930's - with names, activities, locations, photos etc! Don't miss!